Friday, May 09, 2008

An open letter to HRC

This is one of my -very- few commentaries on this sorry clusterfuck of a primary season. Please Maud it will be my last.

Dear Hillary:

I totally, totally hate you. Please go away now kthxbai.

And you know what the bitch of it (something not even -remotely- Freudianly suggestive of internalized sexism) is? I -didn't- particularly hate you before. Was (ETA AND STILL AM IF BY SOME MIRACLE OF MAUD YOU ACTUALLY TURN THIS THING AROUND, I JUST DON'T THINK YOU WILL, OKAY) ready to get behind you or whoever won, albeit without much enthusiasm. Have not been much of an Obama supporter; I voted for him at the last minute, but that was about it. Did not pass go, did not collect my brief flaring of passion for the guy wayyyyy back in '04, did not join the campaign or even write or read more about him. Just went right back to dumb-as-shit blogwars where at least I can engage/spar more or less -personally- with the dumbasses in question; and picking dandruff off the cat; and y'know, generally, my own life, such as it is. No more rah rah goDemsgo for me, thanks.

"I've been hurt before."

Mostly, this round, I've been trying to -ignore- -all- of your sorry asses, and the even dumber and more hateful arguments among your various supporters. All the race-baiting, and the what-trumps-who, and the number-crunching, and the backseat pollstering, and the posturing at great length which we all know perfectly well will mean precisely nothing as soon as victory's in your or anyone's hot little hand, and the fucking FUCKING mass emails and dead trees jamming up my mailbox and the -phone calls-, oh GOD the PHONE calls, how many different ways are there to tell someone you've never met "no, I am not giving you any money, now will you PLEASE take me off your list now PLEASE?"

And no, I can't even reference the latest oh-Christ-what-the-fuck-did-they-do-NOW except in the vaguest of ways, the headdesky racist phone calls in whosit, the dumbass public remark or staff gaffe du jour. Never even mind hahaha the ISSUES. I mean, the difference between your positions and Obama's and how exactly you're each pinky swearing no one's gonna pull away the football THIS time and who probably means it slightly less? Does anyone even know what they -are- anymore? Does anyone care? Do you? Fuck knows I barely do at this point. -trudges off to do quick refresher course, grinding teeth-

-That- bit's my own fault, I admit it.

The bit where I've been too disgusted and jaded to even -bother- paying attention, because I know that once I start I can't avoid an earful of the really hateful, -stupid- shit, plus I don't trust any of you lot as far as I can throw you at this point anyway so I feel like it barely matters? YOUR fault. Among others', -yes-. No, sharing the blame doesn't get your ass off the hook. No, I do not want to hear about your -platform- now, much less how "we can do it! chirp!!" Shut up. YOUR FAULT. (Did I mention the part about 'I hate you?')

ETA: YES, already, if the positions were reversed, I would be addressing this letter to Obama. Hey, I'll even put it in for the hell of it, I'm sure I'll be thinking it again before long.

Dear Barack: I totally, totally hate you and I hate your ass face (actually I kind of do, he physically kind of reminds me of my arch-nemesis at the Dwama School, not his fault, but it doesn't help matters), shut UP shut UP shut UP.

Would be the gist of my appeal, if he were the one losing at the straggling end of this loooooooong ass primary but still plugging away. But...he's not. That simple.

Lookit: It's MAY. McCain's been the Republican nominee for how long? Over a third of a YEAR, you say?

See, if you bunch of sorry-assed Beltway mofos HAD to imitate the Republicans in ANY way, the ONE way you SHOULD be doing it is of course the ONE way you -don't-. To wit:

When it's obvious it's either you or the Party, it's time to finally sit your ass down.

And, like so -many- other people, believe me, of -course- I don't give a fuck about the -Party.- What I do give a fuck about is NOT having THIS guy win, okay:

McCain, whose six years of captivity and torture in Vietnam made him a national celebrity, negotiated (in September 2006) a compromise in the Senate for the Military Commissions Act of 2006, suspending habeas corpus provisions for anyone deemed by the Executive Branch an "unlawful enemy combatant" and barring them from challenging their detentions in court. Coming on the heels of a Supreme Court decision adverse to the White House, McCain's compromise gave a retroactive, nine-year immunity to U.S. officials who authorized, ordered, or committed acts of torture and abuse, and permitted the use of statements obtained through torture to be used in military tribunals so long as the abuse took place by December 30, 2005.[11] McCain's compromise permitted the President to establish permissible interrogation techniques and to "interpret the meaning and application" of international Geneva Convention standards, so long as the coercion fell short of "serious" bodily or psychological injury.[12] Widely dubbed McCain's "torture compromise", the bill was signed into law by George W. Bush on October 17, 2006, shortly before the 2006 midterm elections.

...In October 2007, McCain said of waterboarding that, "They [other presidential candidates] should know what it is. It is not a complicated procedure. It is torture."[14] However, in February 2008 he voted against HR 2082, the Intelligence Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008, which included provisions that would have prevented the CIA from waterboarding prisoners.

...In a major economic speech on April 15, 2008, McCain proposed a number of tax reductions and backed away from his pledge to balance the budget by the end of his first term, saying it would take him eight years. His speech focused on cuts to corporate tax rates and the extension of the Bush tax cuts, and also called for eliminating the alternative-minimum tax and doubling the value of exemptions for dependents to $7,000, This is in contrast to McCain's historical emphasis on deficit reduction over tax cuts. [42]

...The Washington Post noted that "much of what he detailed was a corporate special pleader's dream: a cut in the corporate income tax rate, from 35 percent to 25 percent, a proposal to allow businesses to write off the cost of new equipment and technology from their taxes, a ban on Internet and new cellphone taxes, and a permanent tax credit for research and development."...

McCain is against publicly-funded health care, universal health care, or health coverage mandates, instead favoring tax credits of up to $5,000** for families that get health insurance.

**(had to pay any health care costs out of pocket lately? -major- health care costs, like surgery and longterm hospital stays? basically, this will get you something involving a can opener, some string, and maybe a bottle of duty-free vodka for anaesthetic. never even mind chronic conditions like cancer or lupus or...)

you know, THIS guy:

# Voted NO on adding sexual orientation to definition of hate crimes. (Jun 2002)
# Voted YES on loosening restrictions on cell phone wiretapping. (Oct 2001)
# Voted NO on expanding hate crimes to include sexual orientation. (Jun 2000)

...Rated 0% by the ACLU, indicating an anti-civil rights voting record.
# Rated 33% by the HRC, indicating a mixed record on gay rights. (Dec 2006)
# Rated 7% by the NAACP, indicating an anti-affirmative-action stance. (Dec 2006)

...# Voted NO on repealing tax subsidy for companies which move US jobs offshore. (Mar 2005)
# Voted YES on reforming bankruptcy to include means-testing & restrictions. (Mar 2005)
# Voted YES on restricting rules on personal bankruptcy. (Jul 2001)

...# Voted NO on $52M for "21st century community learning centers". (Oct 2005)
# Voted NO on $5B for grants to local educational agencies. (Oct 2005)
# Voted NO on shifting $11B from corporate tax loopholes to education. (Mar 2005)
# Voted NO on funding smaller classes instead of private tutors. (May 2001)
# Voted NO on funding student testing instead of private tutors. (May 2001)
# Voted NO on spending $448B of tax cut on education & debt reduction. (Apr 2001)

...Voted YES on $75M for abstinence education. (Jul 1996)

...I support the Bush doctrine of pre-emptive war. (Jan 2006)

...and so on. Compare and contrast, if you please, with Obama's positions and record. Might as well start, because he IS the presumptive candidate. Which brings us back to our thesis here, i.e. go away now plzkthxBAI.

What's that you say? But, but but BUT, but...where's my sisterly solidarity? The First Woman President! It had -such- a nice ring to it.

Listen up, because I'm only gonna say this once more: I. Don't. Care.

That's right. Do not care. Don't care if you have EIGHT vaginas. Don't care if you have endorsements from Early Money Is Like A Yeast Infection [ETA this does make me wince on reread, strike one for internalized wotsit] and Ilse Muttersdottir the First Matriarch AND Asphalta the Goddess of Parking Spaces. (ETA: Yes, I know "eight vaginas" and the rest of this bit ISN'T FUNNY AT ALL. I -have- eight vaginas. Damn right it isn't funny. -You- try going to the ob/gyn with...) See this? This is my not bothered at ALL at this point what goddam gender the next President is face, okay. And you want to know cause why?

1) at THIS point, whatever symbolic significance there is in having a woman break that last glass ceiling, and I will admit there is -some-, pretty much we've had it already. It's like the Oscars: the important part is the nomination. Yeah, yeah, I know, no one who's up for one REALLY believes it, and you've been SO ready for your closeup for SO long. Nonetheless. I'm sure the -next- female candidate who -isn't- a total plonker will be indebted to you, as are we all, really. Brava. However, this is a separate question from your PERSONAL ambition, I am afraid, and THAT, well, really not caring about. Like, at all. Sorry.

2) also? If you have to become more and more like Maggie Thatcher to win this thing? Don't want you -anyway.- And say-hey, ever since Maggie lo these couple of decades or so ago, why, there's no more sexism, legally OR culturally, in the UK, right? Right...?

3) yes, we know, there's been really rancid sexism in the media aimed at you. It sucks. We've discussed this. Thing is, of itself, not really enough to make me support -you-, as opposed to simply noting "gorram, those people are sexist fuckstains." What's more, they can and will continue to be sexist fuckstains quite happily with OR without your continued candidacy. It's just how it goes. And, we can attack them for being sexist fuckstains without having to add the obligatory "even though I don't particularly like Hillary herself...", really, we can.

4) -snaps fingers- oh yeah! Womens' RIGHTS, as in what affects the REST of us who AREN'T you and have OTHER primary concerns besides YOUR PERSONAL CAREER.

Well, now, let's see. Here's McCain on reproductive rights.

# Supports repealing Roe v. Wade. (May 2007)
# Voted YES on defining unborn child as eligible for SCHIP. (Mar 2008)
# Voted YES on barring HHS grants to organizations that perform abortions. (Oct 2007)
# Voted YES on expanding research to more embryonic stem cell lines. (Apr 2007)
# Voted YES on notifying parents of minors who get out-of-state abortions. (Jul 2006)
# Voted NO on $100M to reduce teen pregnancy by education & contraceptives. (Mar 2005)
# Voted YES on criminal penalty for harming unborn fetus during other crime. (Mar 2004)
# Voted YES on banning partial birth abortions except for maternal life. (Mar 2003)
# VVoted YES on maintaining ban on Military Base Abortions. (Jun 2000)
# Voted YES on banning partial birth abortions. (Oct 1999)
# Voted YES on banning human cloning. (Feb 1998)
# Expand embryonic stem cell research. (Jun 2004)
# Rated 75% by the NRLC, indicating a mixed record on abortion. (Dec 2006)
# Rated 0% by NARAL, indicating a pro-life voting record. (Dec 2003)

I am pro-life and an advocate for the Rights of Man everywhere in the world, because to be denied liberty is an offense to nature and nature's Creator. I will never waver in that conviction. Our liberty will not be seized in a political revolution or by a totalitarian government. But, rather, as Burke warned, it can be "nibbled away, for expedience, and by parts." I am alert to that risk and will defend against it, and I will be encouraged in that defense by my fellow conservatives.
Source: Speeches to 2008 Conservative Political Action Conference Feb 7, 2008
# Rated 0% by NARAL, indicating a pro-life voting record. (Dec 2003)

I have stated time after time after time that Roe v. Wade was a bad decision, that I support the rights of the unborn.

Q: If Roe v. Wade was overturned during a McCain presidency, and individual states chose to ban abortion, would you be concerned that, as you said, X number of women in America would undergo illegal and dangerous operations?

A: No, I would hope that X women in America would bring those children into life in this world, and that I could do whatever I could to assist them. Again, that conversation from 1999, so often quoted, was in the context of my concerns about changing the culture in America to understand the importance of the rights of the unborn.
Source: Meet the Press: 2007 "Meet the Candidates" series May 13, 2007

On the issue of nominating Supreme Court justices based on an abortion litmus-test, �McCain has said that he will nominate justices based on their experience, and those who share his values,� said a spokesman.

and here's Obama:

* We can find common ground between pro-choice and pro-life. (Apr 2008)
* Undecided on whether life begins at conception. (Apr 2008)
* Teach teens about abstinence and also about contraception. (Apr 2008)
* GovWatch: Obama's "present" votes were a requested strategy. (Feb 2008)
* Expand access to contraception; reduce unintended pregnancy. (Feb 2008)
* Rated 100% by NARAL on pro-choice votes in 2005, 2006 & 2007. (Jan 2008)
* Voted against banning partial birth abortion. (Oct 2007)

* Stem cells hold promise to cure 70 major diseases. (Aug 2007)
* Trust women to make own decisions on partial-birth abortion. (Apr 2007)
* Extend presumption of good faith to abortion protesters. (Oct 2006)
* Constitution is a living document; no strict constructionism. (Oct 2006)
* Pass the Stem Cell Research Bill. (Jun 2004)
* Protect a woman's right to choose. (May 2004)
* Supports Roe v. Wade. (Jul 1998)
* Voted NO on defining unborn child as eligible for SCHIP. (Mar 2008)
* Voted NO on prohibiting minors crossing state lines for abortion. (Mar 2008)
* Voted YES on expanding research to more embryonic stem cell lines. (Apr 2007)
* Voted NO on notifying parents of minors who get out-of-state abortions. (Jul 2006)
* Voted YES on $100M to reduce teen pregnancy by education & contraceptives. (Mar 2005)
* Sponsored bill providing contraceptives for low-income women. (May 2006)
* Rated 0% by the NRLC, indicating a pro-choice stance. (Dec 2006)

* Ensure access to and funding for contraception. (Feb 2007)

Q: What us your view on the decision on partial-birth abortion and your reaction to most of the public agreeing with the court's holding?

A: I think that most Americans recognize that this is a profoundly difficult issue for the women and families who make these decisions. They don't make them casually. And I trust women to make these decisions in conjunction with their doctors and their families and their clergy. And I think that's where most Americans are. Now, when you describe a specific procedure that accounts for less than 1% of the abortions that take place, then naturally, people get concerned, and I think legitimately so. But the broader issue here is: Do women have the right to make these profoundly difficult decisions? And I trust them to do it. There is a broader issue: Can we move past some of the debates around which we disagree and can we start talking about the things we do agree on? Reducing teen pregnancy; making it less likely for women to find themselves in these circumstances.
Source: 2007 South Carolina Democratic primary debate, on MSNBC Apr 26, 2007

Yeah, there is also this.

"In the Illinois state legislature, Obama voted 'present" instead of "no' on five horrendous anti-choice bills."
--E-mail from NOW attacking Sen. Obama's record on abortion issues.

The National Organization for Women has strongly endorsed Hillary Clinton for President. A chain e-mail denounced Obama's record on abortion, citing his "present" votes on a succession of bills sponsored by anti-abortion activists.

The Facts: Under the rules of the Illinois legislature, only yes votes count toward passage of a bill. Planned Parenthood calculated that a 'present' vote by Obama would encourage other senators to cast a similar vote, rather than voting for the legislation [and asked Obama to vote 'present' as a strategy]. NOW never endorsed the Planne Parenthood strategy of voting 'present,' saying "They were horrible bills, and we wanted no votes." Illinois NOW and Planned Parenthood had different voting strategies on the abortion issue. It was impossible for Obama to satisfy both groups at once.
Source: GovWatch on 2008 NOW pro-Clinton campaign literature Feb 6, 2008

You may or may not agree with this spin on his decision. Personally? On the whole, he rides the fence too often for my tastes, yes, on a number of things. Definitely do not love his lip service toward "abstinence" in public school education, although his actual voting on any such isn't clear from that. (We won't even get into the "yay, giant useless expensive fence along the Mexican border which no one including his co-sponsor McCain actually thinks will do any good at all." See above re 'actually, I hate you all and I hate your collective Ass Face.') And yeah, of themselves, the quotes on abortion being a moral issue and so on? Sure, they grind a lot of peoples' teeth. But... look at how he -did- vote, -when- he did.

Now look at McCain. And well--look at you. Are you "better" when it comes to reproductive rights? Well, depends on your perspective, obviously. But assuming one takes the position that "my body, my choice" is sacrosanct, -even if- this were the Most Important Issue Ever: if you -are- better than Obama in this one regard? at this point, by my lights it's not enough to justify your plugging away and risking McCain instead. (Are you listening, Phyllis Chesler?)

Obama: 100% rating by NARAL. McCain: 0% rating by NARAL. Y/N?

Oh, right, okay, but: still, it's been a close race, you're a fighter, yadda yadda. Yes, up to a point. But, the diva, she has -sung-, geddit? He's -ahead-. He's -been- ahead. There's just not that much more to say, and you can't close the gap. And if you're counting on Florida and Michigan, -all- I have to say is: NOW you want to go to the mat over a technicality in fucking Florida rather than concede? NOW?? FUCK YOU.

At this point it's not even about Obama or you. No one wants a gorram intraparty repeat of 2000 here, understand? You're not worth it. Seriously, just...go. Have some damn dignity. Go build houses with Jimmy Carter or something. And, hey, look on the bright side: if Obama wins, and he turns out to be as much or more of a plonker as you, well, hey, at least you won't be the one who's totally, totally hated.

It'll mean less glory too, yes.

You'll live.

And that's all she wrote, folks.

ETA: Let me be a little clearer about one last thing, also. I am not actually saying she should drop out before the last few primary state elections straggle to the end, no. Not at this late date. That would not be reasonable.

What I AM saying is, the suggestions that at the end of those, even if she's in the red in delegates, superdelegates, AND money, she's still gonna plug away at Michigan and Florida and maybe fuck me dead even run as an independent after the nomination (no, I don't think she'd go that far, but there WAS fucking Lieberman, not the same I know, but...)

Again. The last. fucking. thing. anyone wants. is to have a prolonged drag out fight. over a technicality. in FLORIDA.

Please, God? Please? PLEEEASSSEEEEE


Kristin said...

Great post, belle! I feel much the same way... Ugh... Now back to not paying attention to the race.

Oh, and... I love the reference from Waiting for Guffman. Great movie.

Kristin said...


Obama came to my town right before the primary, and you know, living in a small town without much to do, I thought, "Hey, might as well go and listen to the guy talk."

Well, so they had run out of priority tickets by the time I meandered over to the Obama headquarters, but I was told, "You will be able to get in, you just HAVE to register at our website first."

I was stupid and naive at this point, so I did. I registered. And... And... And... I started getting phone calls from Obama people EVERY GODDAMNED DAY asking me to come down and volunteer my time and money. They put me on an EMAIL LIST, and I started getting MASS EMAILS EVERY DAY about Obama.

Almost made me not vote for the guy. Pissed me the fuck off. A really fucking manipulative way to recruit volunteers. I had to manually remove myself from all the lists, and then it finally stopped. I had to say the magic legal "do not call" words to the phone people and ask them to tell me HOW LONG it would take to get me the fuck off the list??? And then they STILL called me three times, the Obama people, to remind me where my POLLING PLACE WAS (it's ON my voter registration card for fuck's sake, I am not an idiot, and I'd have preferred to call the city administrators if I REALLY couldn't figure it out.).

But I voted for him. Without any enthusiasm, with a grimace on my face, hating them both at this point, really. I seriously thought about voting for Hillary instead, only because her people have never CALLED ME DURING DINNER. It is fucking pathetic, really, that it's come to this. And really depressing. God... We are so fucked.

PhysioProf said...

Don't care if you have EIGHT vaginas.


belledame222 said...

yeah, it was a tossup; on the one hand, probably got more calls from the Obama people; on the other hand, got a message on my answering machine "from her," in her own insanely irritating voice. Do Not Want.

and the Do Not Call list doesn't help; it's only for business solicitations. Alas.

and it's like, I -get- it; I've been on the other end of those thankless phone calls and mailings; just, LEAVE ME ALONE, FUCKERS, i don't CARE if it's rational, just leave me ALONE!!

CrackerLilo said...

I pay attention only because the future, as my great-great-grandmother told me, will be decided by people who pay attention.

Hillary doesn't make it easier.

Kristin, Obama and his campaign upset me for the same reason. When I got a person calling me, I finally said, "Look, y'all can either take our money at our pace, or you'll just have to do without it." Calls soon stopped.

Congresscritters would never have approved the DNC list if it included *them*.

Oh, and your post was awesome.

Sarah J said...

That's right. Do not care. Don't care if you have EIGHT vaginas. Don't care if you have endorsements from Early Money Is Like A Yeast Infection and Ilse Muttersdottir the First Matriarch AND Asphalta the Goddess of Parking Spaces. See this? This is my not bothered at ALL at this point what goddam gender the next President is face, okay. And you want to know cause why?


And being one of those people who volunteered for Obama (sorry if I called any of you guys...) I must say that yes, I'm sure you do know where your polling place is, but a lot of people don't. Nor do they know what the hours are, nor most any other bit of info the blogosphere takes for granted.

It's a thankless job, but as you said above, it's the way to beat McCain.

belledame222 said...

Yeah, no, I totally don't blame the volunteers, I -try- to be polite mostly, and calling about where the polling place is doesn't bother me, personally.

What I DO hate: long droning spiel which I either have to forcibly interrupt (or sometimes just hang up on) or suffer through. I've taken to cutting people off as soon as I hear the "Miz [hesitant stumbling over the pronunciation of my last name]?" with "I'm sorry, I don't do this over the phone," and then hanging up whether or not they act as though they understood this. Usually.

Meanwhile, Obama has just edged out HRC in superdelegates.

1) "Superdelegate" is such a -weird- concept. Can you imagine -being- a superdelegate?

"Heeerrrre I commme to save the daaaayyyyy..."

2) Hillary has 271.5 superdelegates. Exactly how does one have .5 of a delegate? Who is the .5, and which half? Inquiring minds and all.

Kristin said...

Hmmm... Yeah, the thing is... Well, I wouldn't have been bothered if they called me *once* to tell me where my polling place was. I live in a rural county, and, well, don't the volunteers sort of keep track of who's been called so far? But three times, even though I asked them not to call again each time? And by then, they'd been calling me just about every day for a couple weeks anyway.

Mostly, though, I felt manipulated, because, I only have a cell phone, not a phone number in the freakin' phone book. And I really, really, really think it's a bad (not to mention disingenuous and dishonest) recruiting tactic to TELL someone that they must provide their contact information on the website in order to get into an event--and then use said contact information to repeatedly contact the person. I didn't sign up for that. I signed up to go to ONE SPEECH.

That said... For the most part, Sarah J, I do appreciate all y'all are doing, and, yeah, I really hope it helps us beat McCain. But if certain tactics are alienating and angering allies (or, if not allies, then those of us who really want to beat McCain), then I have to ask how successful they're going to be?

Now... I know, I know, I know that Obama's internet organizing is kinda what made him a powerhouse and everything, and I'm not debating the tactics in general. And now that the primary is over, they've finally stopped calling (Will it start up again close to the general election?), I'm over it, really... But I didn't like the tactic.

Kristin said...

And, well, maybe it was naive of me to think that they really only wanted my contact information in order to let me get into an event, but, well... Yeah, I didn't like it.

And, yes, I've done the phone calls before, and I know it's a thankless job, and people are rude to the callers... And I haven't told anyone to fuck off, but I have said, "Could you please, please take me off the call list and not call me again? What do I have to do to get off the call list?"

Ah, well... I'm glad the primary's over.

Tom Nolan said...

Belle, I notice that you and Violet Socks (late of this parish) have very different opinions regarding H. Clinton. I was wondering: have you considered debating the pros and cons of your respective positions over at her blog? I should be most interested to read the ensuing debate. In fact I can feel my lips growing moist in anticipation.

greymatters said...

A most interesting post, BD -- one that I find myself slowly coming to feel sympathy with (though a very active Obamaniac for some time now). Until the past month or so, I had more-or-less generally positive estimations of HRC. Lately, not so much.

That said, I just snicker at her attempted appropriation of working-class memes and identities ... at least it has an entertainment quotient.

belledame222 said...

Kristin: not that it helps the irritation, but based on my own experience, my guess would be is that they often have more than one list, strictly out of inefficiency, so that getting struck from one doesn't help when the next volunteer with whatever version of The List comes along.

Tom: I just bet you would. I charge for that sort of thing these days, I'm afraid...

GM: yeah. Plus, how stupid is the whole "white working class people won't vote for Obama?"

1) o hai PoC, I'm writing you off naow, but you can still vote for me, okay?

2) o hai white voters, I think you're racist and stupid, vote for me!!

great...really makes you confident about how she'll do with, like, delicate international diplomacy, you know...

Tom Nolan said...

Tom: I just bet you would. I charge for that sort of thing these days, I'm afraid...


Mais où sont les blog-wars d'antan?

belledame222 said...
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belledame222 said...

They've been around. You just haven't been looking.

anyway, I used to be friendly with VS, and while there's been a lot of water under that bridge, kind of not really wanting to get into it with her, find it vaguely depressing.

also, I really need to start thinking about shit, like, oh, moving across the gorram country.

thene said...

Lovely post. I applaud you for having the balls to write it; I don't want to hate her and tell her to go away, but daymn, since you said it... :P

belledame222 said...

Well, I mean, also, I'm sure she's totally crying herself to sleep after having read this on my blog, you know...

littlem said...

4) -snaps fingers- oh yeah! Womens' RIGHTS, as in what affects the REST of us who AREN'T you and have OTHER primary concerns besides YOUR PERSONAL CAREER.

Heh. Senator A. Marcotte Clinton.

Can haz mah Sennnahtor back nao? *kthx*

1) "Superdelegate" is such a -weird- concept. Can you imagine -being- a superdelegate?

"Heeerrrre I commme to save the daaaayyyyy..."

Edna Mode says: NO CAPES!!!

1) o hai PoC, I'm writing you off naow, but you can still vote for me, okay?

2) o hai white voters, I think you're racist and stupid, vote for me!!

This. This is why they're welcoming you into the MFT program in Cali (*sob*) with open arms. Because they need people with wit and insight, as opposed to Gloms of Rigid and Cranially Clogged Seniority that cling to the DSMV-IV (or however it's spelled) as they swirl about, funneling down in the Ocean of Doom.

Aaaand ... we're done here.

belledame222 said...
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Ohma said...

And let's not forget that if she expects us to credit her with stuff from her husband's time in office, then there are some things which are made rather less flattering. Like her support for DOMA and DADT.

belledame222 said...

yeah, there is that, isn't there. and welcome, ohma, if I hadn't said.

Tom: you fucker. I clicked on your name to see if you'd finally gotten a blog or at least a damn profile or something, and you've -linked to her.- You owe me a new set of eyeballs. gah. do you -know- how much crazy and/or asshole I've already washed out of my hair this week -alone?- do you SEE the kitten post above? I don't resort to kittens lightly, you know. oh, my HEAD.

belledame222 said...

anyway there's not much call for a flamewar, I'm not one of her dreaded Fundie Fascist Obama Flag Wavers (for fuck's sake, drama, much? oh, okay, now, he's as bad as Bush, and we're gonna just, what, bite our pillow...) I just totally hate EVERYONE right now, and there's not much point in me going over there for the first time in over two years and going, by the way, you, TOO, plonker.

belledame222 said...

anyway, why ask me? why not ask -her- that, huh, huh? on second thought, really, don't.

belledame222 said...
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belledame222 said...

...and this, from her "new progressive" list, right at the top: is this a JOKE? i mean, godDAMit, I WAS aVOIDing MOST of this shit, I knew -dimly- but I thought y'know haha maybe I was being -slightly- hyperbolic, um, please tell me this person is kidding? please tell me VS isn't for real, with this? and that -she's- talking about how IRRATIONAL and BOTLIKE the OTHER SIDE are and NO you cannot make me go over and depress myself with them TOO, I...HATE...YOU...ALL...SOOOO...MUUUCCCCHHHH

This is my blog on campaigning for and supporting Hillary Clinton for President! I firmly believe she is the most intelligent, qualified, and experienced "person" running and the fact she is a woman is just icing on the cake!
Wednesday, May 7, 2008

Last night, Hillary won Indiana where Obama won North Carolina. Indiana was a state his campaign predicted they would win by at least 7 points. Well, because Hillary only won Indiana by 2 points, the pundits and media have AGAIN COUNTED HILLARY OUT AND LEFT HER FOR DEAD!!!! They are saying the nomination is over and Obama will be the nominee. He may well turn out to be the nominee, but this is at least the 4th or 5th time throughout this campaign, that Hillary's political demise has been delivered!!! Today George McGovern who supported Hillary early on in the campaign, for him both Bill and Hillary campaigned for him for president in the 70's, has now called on Hillary PUBLICLY TO GET OUT OF THE RACE and he has switched his support to Obama!!! I am SO ANGRY; I AM SEETHING!!!!!

Hillary is the most admirable woman in the world!!! As this campaign has progressed, my admiration and love for her as deepened day by day, month by month. After being counted out time after time, she STILL GETS UP EVERY DAY and goes out there and campaigns. This is a woman who has again lent her campaign another $6 million so she can be competitive with Obama!! Doesn't the fact she has loaned her campaign over $11 million already, and is willing to give more, SHOW HOW PASSIONATE SHE IS TO HELP THIS COUNTRY?????

I just made by upteenth call to the DNC. I told them how ANGRY I was; how I was SEETHING!!! I said Hillary won Indiana last night and all I'm hearing is how she should get out of the race; the race is over, "she's toast", etc. I told them that I had said all along that I WOULD NEVER VOTE FOR OBAMA BUT THAT I WOULD WRITE IN HILLARY'S NAME, but I have gone one step further. I am SO ANGRY that I have decided if Hillary does not get the nomination which she deserves and has earned, I WILL VOTE FOR MC CAIN!!!!! And that goes against everything I believe in, but at least I RESPECT MC CAIN! I DO NOT RESPECT OBAMA!!! I DO NOT TRUST OBAMA!!!! I THINK OBAMA WOULD BE TERRIBLY DANGEROUS FOR THIS COUNTRY!!!

In both states last night, 50% of Hillary's supporters said THEY WOULD NOT VOTE FOR OBAMA!!! They will either vote for McCain or not vote at all. I am not giving up yet. Hillary is a FIGHTER and she might still have some tricks up her sleeve. I PRAY SHE WILL STILL WIN THIS NOMINATION. I want to vote for the person I believe in!! I want to vote for the person who will be great for this country!!! I want to vote for the person who will be a GREAT PRESIDENT!!! I WANT TO VOTE FOR HILLARY CLINTON!!!!!!!!!!!


I'm not sure, but I think she's saying that she's for Hillary, there.

-stabs self- -drinks Lysol-

jesus fuck, can't these people indulge their passions in something -healthy-, like, I don't know, Harry Potter fandom or something? This person is 55? and she sounds like a rabid Harmonian (no, don't ask me how I even know about this shit, really).


and, so, wait, it's the Obamabots we're worried about, says sensible VS.


I mean, I'm this fucked off and I'd -barely- been paying attention. can you imagine if I'd -actually- been reading this shit for real all this time? i'd have defenestrated myself long since. GAG me. look, I was a Deaniac more or less, but I didn't pull this pathetic crap...

Tom Nolan said...

Sorry, Belle, that was just a joke about you getting into a blogwar with Violent Shocks. That couldn't happen anyway. She would just delete your comments.

I have to say, though, that watching her head explode on a more or less daily basis has provided me with much innocent amusement over the last weeks. She campaigns against Obama with exactly the same hands-around-the-throat zeal that she campaigns against pornographers and sex-positive feminists: all she's done is point the fire-hose of her indignation in a different direction.

Tom Nolan said...

I am SO ANGRY that I have decided if Hillary does not get the nomination which she deserves and has earned, I WILL VOTE FOR MC CAIN!!!!!

And if I can't buy that doggy in the window - you know, the one with the waggly tail - I'm gonna buy a fully grown sea-crocodile instead and take it home as a pet. And it'll probably eat me and my whole fucking family! Good!!!! Then you'll be sorry. Too bad I won't be around to say "I told you so".

"I'd rather cut off my nose and spite my face than vote for Obama."

butterflywings said...

Er, what?!
I understand you don't like HRC.

But - when you spill *so* much vitriol against someone, there is something going on.

You don't even quote Hillary's policies, only McCain's and Obama's. Probably because they are much the same as Obamarama's.

And I am so tired of "euw vote for Obaaaama or nasty misogynist McCain will win!"...huh? Yep, good women are self sacrificing and step down and let the menz take over, cos they are nasty and divisive if everyone doesn't like them!

Last time I heard there were still 2 people in the race. Why shouldn't there be?

So what if it is Hillary's personal ambition to be President? Is there something wrong with women being ambitious? Or is it bad to want euw icky POWER?

And can you imagine what a WOMAN PRESIDENT of the frckin USA would do for women all over the world?

I despair of some so-called feminists.

butterflywings said...

PS. 8 vaginas? What?
Reducing women to their body parts?
Crude misogyny. You sound like some McCain supporting redneck dude.

Tom Nolan said...

And can you imagine what a WOMAN PRESIDENT of the frckin USA would do for women all over the world?

I'm interested. What?

Octogalore said...

Tom, would you ask that question if BW had asked about a president of color?

I understand the frustration with this election, but am really puzzled by this.

Tom Nolan said...


Yes, I think I would. If somebody said: "vote for this black man or woman for President - just think of the good they will do for black people everywhere!" I would indeed think it quite right to ask what, specifically, the black candidate in question was going to do for people who coincidentally shared his/her skin colour.

Octogalore said...

Hmm, Mary Lou Retton inspired a number of little girls to do gymnastics and FloJo inspired a number of GOC to do track. Neither of them were going out recruiting. My sister is thrilled with Lucy Liu, an Asian woman, being visible in media although Lucy has never reached out to her directly.

It would be wonderful if HRC or BHO actually reached out to women and POC in different countries as well as in the US and made some substantive changes that the old white men haven't. But there would be a significant effect beyond that just by showing up. It seems disingenous to question that.

Tom Nolan said...

But there would be a significant effect beyond that just by showing up. It seems disingenous to question that - Octo

Octo, I'm having difficulty following your reasoning here. Why, when somebody claims "candidate X, who is a woman, a coloured person, a Catholic etc. will do so much good for women, coloured people, Catholics the world over" - why is it disingenuous to ask what that good would consist of? And even if, by a miracle of telepathy, you were to know that the personal motives behind the question were nefarious, that still shouldn't prevent you from answering it. In my experience, the best way to deal with a disingenuous question is to meet it with a straight answer.

belledame222 said...

*sigh* dear BW: I do not have vitriol against Hillary as a candidate or as a woman. I do have vitriol against the people who are basically going they're gonna go home and BITE THEIR PILLOW if she doesn't WIN, dammit, and the incredible long-ass dragging out of this whole fucknutted thing. I am sure the Obama people are doing the same thing, probably, somewhere, but right now it's less obvious to me -where-. perhaps this is only because they're, you know, winning. perhaps not. perhaps i am being completely unfair. i. don't. CARE. understand?

See the part wherein "I hate this entire primary and I hate you all?" See the part where "can we PLEASE talk about fucking McCain sometime before fucking August MAYBE?" See the part wherein FUCKING MAKE IT STOP ALREADY? THAT. THAT.

as per reducing women to their body parts: yes, you've got me there, I am a crude sexist McCain supporter. Otoh I -do- have eight vaginas. It's great, let me tell you.

belledame222 said...

I have the same question as Tom, I guess.


Catherine the fucking Great, for that matter. Madame Mao? Evita?

I will say that yeah, representation matters to -some- degree. You know what I was thinking last night, actually? wherein I alienate absolutely everyone? That in fact, much as I loathe the entire fucking Bush admin, the fact that we've gotten used to seeing Colin Powell and then Condi in positions of power may well have contributed to the landscape finally being in a place wherein the primary deadlock can be between HRC and Obama. That if Bush hadn't decided to fill those positions with really awful people who happened to be women and/or people of color, maybe that would've made it steeper now. Maybe not.

This does not, however, mean that Condi was any better for any actual women living under her -policy- wise.

This is the problem I have with representation: yes, you'd -think- so and so would be "better for" their affinity group, but it doesn't necessarily follow. And then, it's like...we're all supposed to live vicariously through such and so's success. "Go, and do likewise." Well, no, it may not be either feasible or desirable, point of fact.

Ever read or see "Top Girls?"

That said, YES, already, I think HRC is, well, at minimum certainly much better for women than fucking McCain. (Well, some women, anyway; on the whole though, I can't think of -any- women as a group who'd be better off under McCain, with the possible exception of those who're only really affected by the tax breaks and such). Slightly because, hay, she's a woman; much more so because, hay, policies.

Otoh I would've been fine with Edwards, too; and I'm ALSO FINE WITH OBAMA DAMMIT.

and this is what's driving me crazy. Look, to turn it around to BW: I get not liking Obama, but the sort of damn damn DAMN a woman will NEVER WIN now might as well give up utterly that Violet (as Tom pointed out, curse his twisted little heart) and others are spouting: what the fuck? Seriously: what the fucking FUCK?
Fine, okay, let her fight on then, although I REALLY WISH it wouldn't drag out till fucking AUGUST; but for fuck's SAKE, people, "oh, he's as bad as McCain." NO. shut UP. GOD.

Look, am I saying Hillary is as bad as McCain? No, I am not. What I am saying is: at THIS juncture she appears to be losing, and most of us are so BEYOND sick of the whole fucking thing, and YEAH, a bit nervous given the D's amazing ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

and that yeah, great, ambition, but not to the expense of everyone and everything ELSE. I'd say it to/about ANYONE who was still clawing on at this point. Fuck knows I said it about fucking Lieberman, and much more besides.

belledame222 said...
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belledame222 said...
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belledame222 said...

and, okay, THIS is what fucks me off altogether:

these people who are all like, o boy o boy HILLARY OR BUST?


and now, here we are again, four years later, and YEAH, for a lot of people the world DID end, same as it always has cause garsh, there's more to U.S. policy than you imagined, Horatio, and more people in the world, too, but well never mind;

but fact is, the world still continues to turn, against all odds, and now it's yet ANOTHER fucking crisis. No, the world won't end if McCain wins either. It'll just mean more unnecessary misery for a lot of people that could've been spared. YOU'LL probably be fine, o flag-waving peanut gallery, gearing up for the NEXT test match, all sound and fury and signifying nothing. Aren't you always? I mean, why else get all het up over the CANDIDATES and not the ISSUES if the ISSUES actually -ulp- aren't all that important to you really?

fuck you all, really.

Ohma said...

Thankyee-sai for the welcome Belle.

I agree with you heartily about the crazily longassedness of these primaries, and that it's ridiculous that there are people threatening to not vote unless their favorite candidate wins.

I'm a (semi)avid Obama supporter, and I have many problems with Hillary's stances on various issues. However, she's still head and shoulders above McCain, and if she were to (somehow) win the nomination I would vote for her in the general election. I honestly feel that the people (er, democratic leaning voters to be more specific) who say they wouldn't vote for either Hillary or Obama because one of them isn't their *favorite* candidate aren't mature enough to make an educated choice in the first place.

belledame222 said...

yep, and yep. and of course, since I said I hoped this would be my last post on the subject, I'm currently wending my way through a longass follow-up which does indeed refer Violet Socks, among others. Tom, you owe me bigtime.

Octogalore said...

Belle and Tom -- as to your question, I tried to answer it in my most recent post, from last week.

I read and enjoyed Top Girls when we last discussed.

Tom Nolan said...

Tom, you owe me bigtime

Tickets to see Tennant's Hamlet at the National? I'll even throw in a pre-theatre meal.

belledame222 said...

dude, if you're serious? I'm totally on my way over. SRSLY. would love to take a trip if I could possibly swing it in any way.

belledame222 said...

seriously, how long is it running? has it already started? my dad's going on a business trip to London in a month or so, I told him to try to score tickets if he could. he doesn't know from Tennant, but a good production of Hamlet, he was interested.

Tom Nolan said...

Performances between July and November, apparently - and at the RSC (i.e. in Stratford), rather than the National. If you're coming to Blighty, let me know and I'll try to arrange something. I could even get a college room for you for a day or two.

belledame222 said...

I wish. If only I weren't moving and y'know starting school. well, maybe Hillary or -someone- will be my fairy godmother and somehow let it be so.

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