"You're the vulgarian, you fuck."

Okay, I know this is cheap as all hell, it's Satsuma for fuck's sake, but still, marvel at it, really:

http://www.womensspace.org/phpBB2/2008/04/21/on-the-pornography-panel-debate-at-william-mary-college-in-support-of-samantha-berg/#comment-16199

[surprise]

Ultimately, I believe pornography is about lack of imagination and dehumanization. It really shouldn’t be a debate at all, but people seem to have an incredible lack of sense delving into what degrades and dehumanizes women. Gay men have become so corrupted by this garbage that they live in a lost world all the time.

Young women take on the worst of this, and so vulgarity pervades even this site. Think what most obscenity really is about: insulting the honor of women. That and a rape language culture.

I pretty much make it a policy to let people know that if they are into porn, do drugs or act in vulgar ways, I won’t deal with them. Look for people who care about others, leave behind the vulgar and the clueless. Make it a point to look at art, and to know the difference between what is art and what is pornography.

In a degraded media saturated culture, where violence on TV is common, where blogs are filled with woman hating propaganda, it is about finding what is good in the world.

I find that the arts are a wonderful way to see all that is best and beautiful. Listen to great music often, go to museums, have conversations with people who strive to learn and grow, and encourage all people to share in the beauty of culture that has been around for hundreds of years. There is an antidote to the vulgar; the sound of Vivaldi, an incredible sunset or an Emily Dickinson poem… Turn off the cell phones, turn off the T.V., and savor the conversation and friendship of people who are serious and committed to this life of the mind, and you’ll help defeat pornography.

Pursue the good, and in every way your life will be amazing, sink down to the bad, and bit by bit year after year your character will become degraded. Like the picture of Dorian Grey, this reveals itself in time, unfortunately when it is too late.

Too bad the only anti-porn advocates I ever hear on the radio are right wing christian men. In fact, that is the only time ever that I hear men condemn pornography publically. Hmmm…. what side are men really on?

It is a gift. A -gift-. You can't parody this shit.

In fact, I'm sorely tempted to go along with what appears to be a not unpopular thesis among fellow rubberneckers and speculate that this has all been a very long and elaborate deadpan gag, the Satsuma character, one that would put Andy Kaufman to shame. And I mean, anything's still possible.

On the other hand, well, from slightly more...known...quantities, you also have...well.

Love will drive out the demonic forces of S/M and porn. [--Satsuma]

I believe this with all my heart.

...I agree with you re mental illness in the SM culture and also ::::zipping into flame-retardant suit::: among transpersons, i.e., MTFs that hang around lesbian groups/venues. Someone I very much respect who has done very fine work on transgender issues, a radical/lesbian feminist, said a while back she thinks that quite often, doctors, psychologists, etc. encourage “transitioning” because it’s something concrete that they *can* do, but that it doesn’t help, because again, so often these are not really gender issues the person has, these are issues of mental illness, and as some of us have seen, transitioning is no cure for mental illness.

... by womensspace [aka Heart] February 19, 2008 at 9:22 pm

Isn't she great, folks? Let's give 'er a big round of applause (she seems to be sorely in need of one, after all). Clap, clap.

A bit more wisdom from our favorite wacky l'il citrus fruit to round off with, since she would graciously, if inadvertently, seem to be answering the question I posed here, to wit:

"And I want to know, from feminists, lesbians included: exactly how it is that you justify "being transgendered is an ideology/sickness/perversion/trend" when these are EXACTLY the arguments, but EXACTLY, used by homophobes*.

So, here's one theory:

Remember lesbian porn is viewed by straight men, and this porn addiction will hurt straight women. Straight men force women into sex acts with other women because of this. You will be humiliated by straight men if you don’t stand solid against the entire range of pornographic evil, and it is evil! Sometimes evangelical christians are on to evil, and they have taught us to fight it. It is demonic, and it will destroy the character of women, whether they know it or not.

So this is a fight we can all be in, and we need to be honest about how women are made mentally ill by male sexual colonization. We need to have space for women who have never ever had sex with men — this is a great power women have had througout history, and we overlook the greatness of this. We should celebrate these power women who have kept their bodies free of rape that is ALL SEX with men. Sex with men is rape, whether women want to admit it or not, if women have to rely on it to get fed or taken care of.

MTF lesbians are invading women’s space both straight and lesbian all over the place. Straight women won’t have their spaces either if this persists.

So we can work together to eliminate this preditory assault by the newest form of patriarchal invasion of women’s selves, or we can continue to pretend that lesbians don’t exist, or that we are there to support straight women at our own expense.

...we are the old soldiers who know who we are and where we came from.
We don’t lose sleep over “gender queer” and all the tiresome sex obsessed world that has become more and more the public face of lesbians in big cities.

If we can’t agree on the freedom for women to define and create groups that meet their needs as oppressed minorities, then what’s the point of it all?

Transwomen can aid the cause of women, by doing the anti-rape work, by having marches supporting women’s rights etc. I say, just do the work. But if you harass women at Michfest, or butt into young lesbian coming out groups with porno-talk, and S & M, and just vulgar yuck that I associate with male banter, well then I have a real problem with this.

Clear (eyed gaze) now?